Here’s where the confusions get sorted out for you.
Ask and you shall be answered.
46 thoughts on “DA Confusions on the 12/13th of November, 2010”
Lou, think of another word for monks.
and put short form for runs into a word for anxieties
18A, “Charming bunch” is the definition, then the wordplay is “close to volcanic” followed by something equivalent to “range”
Thanks SR, mindsets are terrible things, i was thinking of a different range.
A few questions about the clues.
19D – Why are the 3-down elusive? Maybe I don’t know enough about them.
16A – How does the wordplay work here? I got the fraud part but can’t see how skipper works.
25A – How does the wordplay work here?
19D- elusive footballers, hard to catch
16A – skipper = captain = c
25A – article = an, on = leg, as in cricket
Thanks JJ!
In 16A I was looking to skip ‘per’ and couldn’t see how per = c. I was making it too complicated!
Rugby isn’t my game, but I should have got the cricket reference.
Cheers.
Possibly misguided spoilers below:
I have a lot of confusion this week! I thought 10a was brilliant – but unfortunately it didn’t help with 4d – the only thing I can fit in is Twomen!
Also 21d is giving me trouble, but I’m not sure if I have 20a and 26a correct – are they ‘brown’ and ‘red lake’ (is the latter because it sounds vaguely like ‘read ache?’) – I doubt I’m on the right track here (is ‘interpreted’ or ‘in ear’ the homophone indicator? Is ‘red lake’ even a colour, like crimson lake)?
And – not sure of the wordplay on 8a (is it wayward?) and 23d (get the second half – z in gag, but where does the zi come from?)
Cheers, Sam.
Sam, you have 8a and 26a wrong (8a is the only clue i have left, but it doesn’t start with ‘w’)
23d: ZI = ZIP almost
Hi Sam,I too had a bit of trouble, but eventually with help of dictionary to explain wordplay down …
6A – anagram plus word for ‘with’ with no ‘leader’
20A is right as the brothers make wine, including of a particular colour.
26A – think rose’
23D – crack as in wisecrack, speed as in zip
4D – think 70’s American soft rock band
Sorry, meant 8a not 6a
Oops, just realized 1st sentence in 1st post makes no sense. Meant to refer to 21D where I’d never heard of answer until looked up in Dictionary.
Thanks Mic and LJ – sorted! Definately was lead astray by colours this week. 20a and 26a now make sense. I’d never heard of 21d before, not your usual fur producer. 8a is still tricky – as where is the ‘brother’ indicator? Does the ellipsis mean you take it from 7a? Also, was nice to see my name turn up in the middle this week!
I don’t get the ‘classic’ part of the wordplay for 7d: could someone here enlighten me?
The first 4 letters of the word is another meaning for a classic…or so I interpreted.
Thanks… turned out I had the wrong African runner, hence the confusion.
A quibble regarding 3d. “Monkhood” is different to “monks” and it would have been more accurate to use the word “monks” without spoiling the clue.
I also need help with the “inert” part of 10a. The rest of it is all very good in my opinion & I loved the reference to the good doctor’s transport.
JK – it’s the speed of an object through air, at zero
JK: I agree with your monkhood quibble.
Sam: This is one of those cases where the ellipsis actually has a function other than to improve the surface reading of both clues (and to annoy AS!). As you say, the last part of the 7A clue also belongs to the 8A clue.
I enjoyed 24A, 15D.
A couple (nutria, allman) very obscure for me. A few others a bit obscure, but gettable, and a couple of queries:
20A: Is maroon = brown? It’s close, I agree, but not nearly close enough for me.
26A: Is it acceptable to write the wine “rose” without the accute accent over the “e”?
And can you really call it a red
11A: Which part of the clue generates the “temp” ?
25A: Got “angel” but how does this clue work ?
Thought 18A was brilliant!
Hi,
What was the solution to “inert Tarzan”? The best I could think of was noble. The nobel gases being inert, and Tarzan being a “noble savage”! Any help appreciated.
It was ‘Macho’, being that mach 0 is stationary.
GQ,
JJ has already answered 25A above.
re 11A Fairly blank = empty – y = empt , cutting hair (tress) = temptress
I agree with RB that “maroon” is NOT “brown”, and that rosé should have an accent.
According to Wikipedia, Tarzan was most definitely not “macho” (= aggressively masculine).
“Stationary rambo” might have been a better clue for 10a (agree inert is misleading even for mach o which I didn’t get).
GQ, Re angel – an is an article & leg (reversed) is a cricket synonym for on.
Thanks JD. Nice work. That’s difficult!
I enjoyed this one hugely. Have to agree with the quibble on maroon/brown, and (with less enthusiasm) on rose, but if that’s the worst we have then it’s a great crossword.
I didn’t enjoy this one that much. Too many obscure words/references (4D, 7D, 18D, 21D), and didn’t like the clue for 8A at all (notwithstanding the ellipsis element confusing things). Didn’t like blind (8A) or service (2D) as anagram indicators either, or equating ‘maroon’ with ‘brown’. And using ‘c’ for skipper is a bit of a stretch in my book, though prepared to begrudgingly accept it.
Can anyone help with 20d. the anzac cook I suppose is baker, but why fabulous brothers of film? My search only came up with a film called ‘The Wendell Baker Story’ which I have never heard of.
The Fabulous Baker Boys was a movie starrring the Bridges brothers (Beau and Jeff) as a piano duo act, who are joined by Michelle Pfeiffer, who plays a singer. I’m sure the scene where she sings ‘Making Woopie’ is available on youtube.
Correction, ‘Makin’ Whoopee”
I’ve been outwhinged! Pretty good rant there, jnrj. I agree on the obscurities, and I could have added more to your list. Most were gettable (for me), but I felt DA had too many this week.
As for maroon/brown, I’ve already whinged about that; as I have for rose (maybe DA, like me, couldn’t figure out how to get the acute accent).
But I’m prepared to defend the anaginds: “blind” (8A) works for me in the sense of “drunk”; as does “service” (2D) in the sense of repairs and maintenance (or even animal husbandry).
In 16A, I didn’t get skipper = c at first, thinking that it just signified that a letter was to be skipped from “scam”. But I reckon skipper = captain = c is OK. In cricket, the captain is often referred to as the skipper, and the team sheet will show a “c” by the name.
Thanks JD, this explains why I got nowhere searching for ‘Baker Brothers’
I think DA thought the movie was called The Fabulous Baker Brothers. Confess DA.
I thought this one was great – I got all the answers but one, which makes it a personal DA best. I don’t see a problem with maroon=brown. Maroon could be classed as a shade of brown, I would think. Also, didn’t really notice the missing accent on Rose either. However, I still don’t know what the answer to 24A is! Can someone please enlighten me? (Or am I bit late given that this was last week’s crossword?)
KRAY TWINS. Notorious London criminals in the 1950s and 60s.
Ok, at the risk of revealing my general level of ignorance, here’s the list of “things I’m surprised I was expected to know” (AKA “things I needed an internet connection for”….
– Kray twins (never heard of ’em)
– Inert = Mach 0 (ok, ok, but strewth. Inert usually means “unreactive”)
– Maroon brothers = Brown brothers
– Karamazov (only for the spelling)
– Uppsala (where?)
– Gemsbok = fast African antelope (fair enough, but the “general knowledge”-o-meter is rising)
– Leg = On (ok, so I’m a sporting heathen in a sport-mad country – if most people know that reference, then fair enough)
– Astrological signs are “houses” – also fair enough – need to remember that one
– Nutria = Fur producing rodent (**PING!** The general knowledge-o-meter goes off!)
– Ella brothers (sigh, sport again. Oh well.)
A bit demoralised again this week. I’d move to a different day, but Saturday’s Age is the only one we have time to read each week (and I don’t like admitting I can’t do things!)
So you’d heard of the Allman brothers then? I hadn’t!
8A I took this differently and had no problem with either the ellipsis or blind: I thought it was an anagram with the first letters of blind removed.
Wasn’t Cher married to an Allman brother once (or still)?
My 8A take would make more sense if it said ‘with no leaders’ ?
Your take on 8A was my first theory too, Peter, but it fails on two counts: as well as the leader/leaders problem, there’s also no anagram indicator.
Aw, man. No RB I hadn’t heard of the Allman brothers. I missed them off my list.
I was much happier with the Nov 20 puzzle though – Perhaps DA took pity on me? See my post there.
CL, you will have noticed from the comments above that you’re not alone in your whinge about obscurities. But I recommend that you remember at least two of your list, as they will surely crop up again, especially the first one:
Leg = on. Could also be clued as “side”, as the cricket pitch has two sides: the on (or leg) side and the off side.
Astrological “houses”. I believe these are not the same as signs, but there are twelve of them and they may have the same names. I don’t know any more – astrology is a complete mystery to me and I’m exceedingly happy for it to remain so.
Thanks RB.
Ah, deciding what to remember – that’s very useful, thanks!
I’m reminded of a Sherlock Holmes / Watson dialogue where Holmes has learned some piece of trivia that he deems to be useless, and he says something like, “now that I’ve learned that I will do my utmost to foget it”
Watson says, “why?”
Holmes: “because I make it a point to only keep useful information in my head. There’s not enough room to fill it with useless information”
(apologies for the woeful quote from memory)
Of course, deciding what counts as useful information then becomes the next challenge :)
Lou, think of another word for monks.
and put short form for runs into a word for anxieties
18A, “Charming bunch” is the definition, then the wordplay is “close to volcanic” followed by something equivalent to “range”
Thanks SR, mindsets are terrible things, i was thinking of a different range.
A few questions about the clues.
19D – Why are the 3-down elusive? Maybe I don’t know enough about them.
16A – How does the wordplay work here? I got the fraud part but can’t see how skipper works.
25A – How does the wordplay work here?
19D- elusive footballers, hard to catch
16A – skipper = captain = c
25A – article = an, on = leg, as in cricket
Thanks JJ!
In 16A I was looking to skip ‘per’ and couldn’t see how per = c. I was making it too complicated!
Rugby isn’t my game, but I should have got the cricket reference.
Cheers.
Possibly misguided spoilers below:
I have a lot of confusion this week! I thought 10a was brilliant – but unfortunately it didn’t help with 4d – the only thing I can fit in is Twomen!
Also 21d is giving me trouble, but I’m not sure if I have 20a and 26a correct – are they ‘brown’ and ‘red lake’ (is the latter because it sounds vaguely like ‘read ache?’) – I doubt I’m on the right track here (is ‘interpreted’ or ‘in ear’ the homophone indicator? Is ‘red lake’ even a colour, like crimson lake)?
And – not sure of the wordplay on 8a (is it wayward?) and 23d (get the second half – z in gag, but where does the zi come from?)
Cheers, Sam.
Sam, you have 8a and 26a wrong (8a is the only clue i have left, but it doesn’t start with ‘w’)
23d: ZI = ZIP almost
Hi Sam,I too had a bit of trouble, but eventually with help of dictionary to explain wordplay down …
6A – anagram plus word for ‘with’ with no ‘leader’
20A is right as the brothers make wine, including of a particular colour.
26A – think rose’
23D – crack as in wisecrack, speed as in zip
4D – think 70’s American soft rock band
Sorry, meant 8a not 6a
Oops, just realized 1st sentence in 1st post makes no sense. Meant to refer to 21D where I’d never heard of answer until looked up in Dictionary.
Thanks Mic and LJ – sorted! Definately was lead astray by colours this week. 20a and 26a now make sense. I’d never heard of 21d before, not your usual fur producer. 8a is still tricky – as where is the ‘brother’ indicator? Does the ellipsis mean you take it from 7a? Also, was nice to see my name turn up in the middle this week!
I don’t get the ‘classic’ part of the wordplay for 7d: could someone here enlighten me?
The first 4 letters of the word is another meaning for a classic…or so I interpreted.
Thanks… turned out I had the wrong African runner, hence the confusion.
A quibble regarding 3d. “Monkhood” is different to “monks” and it would have been more accurate to use the word “monks” without spoiling the clue.
I also need help with the “inert” part of 10a. The rest of it is all very good in my opinion & I loved the reference to the good doctor’s transport.
JK – it’s the speed of an object through air, at zero
JK: I agree with your monkhood quibble.
Sam: This is one of those cases where the ellipsis actually has a function other than to improve the surface reading of both clues (and to annoy AS!). As you say, the last part of the 7A clue also belongs to the 8A clue.
I enjoyed 24A, 15D.
A couple (nutria, allman) very obscure for me. A few others a bit obscure, but gettable, and a couple of queries:
20A: Is maroon = brown? It’s close, I agree, but not nearly close enough for me.
26A: Is it acceptable to write the wine “rose” without the accute accent over the “e”?
And can you really call it a red
11A: Which part of the clue generates the “temp” ?
25A: Got “angel” but how does this clue work ?
Thought 18A was brilliant!
Hi,
What was the solution to “inert Tarzan”? The best I could think of was noble. The nobel gases being inert, and Tarzan being a “noble savage”! Any help appreciated.
It was ‘Macho’, being that mach 0 is stationary.
GQ,
JJ has already answered 25A above.
re 11A Fairly blank = empty – y = empt , cutting hair (tress) = temptress
I agree with RB that “maroon” is NOT “brown”, and that rosé should have an accent.
According to Wikipedia, Tarzan was most definitely not “macho” (= aggressively masculine).
“Stationary rambo” might have been a better clue for 10a (agree inert is misleading even for mach o which I didn’t get).
GQ, Re angel – an is an article & leg (reversed) is a cricket synonym for on.
Thanks JD. Nice work. That’s difficult!
I enjoyed this one hugely. Have to agree with the quibble on maroon/brown, and (with less enthusiasm) on rose, but if that’s the worst we have then it’s a great crossword.
I didn’t enjoy this one that much. Too many obscure words/references (4D, 7D, 18D, 21D), and didn’t like the clue for 8A at all (notwithstanding the ellipsis element confusing things). Didn’t like blind (8A) or service (2D) as anagram indicators either, or equating ‘maroon’ with ‘brown’. And using ‘c’ for skipper is a bit of a stretch in my book, though prepared to begrudgingly accept it.
Can anyone help with 20d. the anzac cook I suppose is baker, but why fabulous brothers of film? My search only came up with a film called ‘The Wendell Baker Story’ which I have never heard of.
The Fabulous Baker Boys was a movie starrring the Bridges brothers (Beau and Jeff) as a piano duo act, who are joined by Michelle Pfeiffer, who plays a singer. I’m sure the scene where she sings ‘Making Woopie’ is available on youtube.
Correction, ‘Makin’ Whoopee”
I’ve been outwhinged! Pretty good rant there, jnrj. I agree on the obscurities, and I could have added more to your list. Most were gettable (for me), but I felt DA had too many this week.
As for maroon/brown, I’ve already whinged about that; as I have for rose (maybe DA, like me, couldn’t figure out how to get the acute accent).
But I’m prepared to defend the anaginds: “blind” (8A) works for me in the sense of “drunk”; as does “service” (2D) in the sense of repairs and maintenance (or even animal husbandry).
In 16A, I didn’t get skipper = c at first, thinking that it just signified that a letter was to be skipped from “scam”. But I reckon skipper = captain = c is OK. In cricket, the captain is often referred to as the skipper, and the team sheet will show a “c” by the name.
Thanks JD, this explains why I got nowhere searching for ‘Baker Brothers’
I think DA thought the movie was called The Fabulous Baker Brothers. Confess DA.
I thought this one was great – I got all the answers but one, which makes it a personal DA best. I don’t see a problem with maroon=brown. Maroon could be classed as a shade of brown, I would think. Also, didn’t really notice the missing accent on Rose either. However, I still don’t know what the answer to 24A is! Can someone please enlighten me? (Or am I bit late given that this was last week’s crossword?)
KRAY TWINS. Notorious London criminals in the 1950s and 60s.
Ok, at the risk of revealing my general level of ignorance, here’s the list of “things I’m surprised I was expected to know” (AKA “things I needed an internet connection for”….
– Kray twins (never heard of ’em)
– Inert = Mach 0 (ok, ok, but strewth. Inert usually means “unreactive”)
– Maroon brothers = Brown brothers
– Karamazov (only for the spelling)
– Uppsala (where?)
– Gemsbok = fast African antelope (fair enough, but the “general knowledge”-o-meter is rising)
– Leg = On (ok, so I’m a sporting heathen in a sport-mad country – if most people know that reference, then fair enough)
– Astrological signs are “houses” – also fair enough – need to remember that one
– Nutria = Fur producing rodent (**PING!** The general knowledge-o-meter goes off!)
– Ella brothers (sigh, sport again. Oh well.)
A bit demoralised again this week. I’d move to a different day, but Saturday’s Age is the only one we have time to read each week (and I don’t like admitting I can’t do things!)
So you’d heard of the Allman brothers then? I hadn’t!
8A I took this differently and had no problem with either the ellipsis or blind: I thought it was an anagram with the first letters of blind removed.
Wasn’t Cher married to an Allman brother once (or still)?
My 8A take would make more sense if it said ‘with no leaders’ ?
Your take on 8A was my first theory too, Peter, but it fails on two counts: as well as the leader/leaders problem, there’s also no anagram indicator.
Aw, man. No RB I hadn’t heard of the Allman brothers. I missed them off my list.
I was much happier with the Nov 20 puzzle though – Perhaps DA took pity on me? See my post there.
CL, you will have noticed from the comments above that you’re not alone in your whinge about obscurities. But I recommend that you remember at least two of your list, as they will surely crop up again, especially the first one:
Leg = on. Could also be clued as “side”, as the cricket pitch has two sides: the on (or leg) side and the off side.
Astrological “houses”. I believe these are not the same as signs, but there are twelve of them and they may have the same names. I don’t know any more – astrology is a complete mystery to me and I’m exceedingly happy for it to remain so.
Thanks RB.
Ah, deciding what to remember – that’s very useful, thanks!
I’m reminded of a Sherlock Holmes / Watson dialogue where Holmes has learned some piece of trivia that he deems to be useless, and he says something like, “now that I’ve learned that I will do my utmost to foget it”
Watson says, “why?”
Holmes: “because I make it a point to only keep useful information in my head. There’s not enough room to fill it with useless information”
(apologies for the woeful quote from memory)
Of course, deciding what counts as useful information then becomes the next challenge :)
Houses, Legs and (**sigh**) Lav-ender…
CL