22 thoughts on “The Confusions about DA on the 13/14th of August, 2010

  1. 11A: I think this is part of the wall but not quite the roof.
    13A: I know this term better as a defence in an argument (a ruse of introducing something completely irrelevant).

  2. My 87 y.o. mom got most of it out but for 9A put The Bill so was led a tad astray in the top LH corner. It is the first time for a while that she hasn’t thrown it on the floor on stomped on it.

  3. Another enjoyable offering from DA, but right now the wordplay for 15D escapes me. Any help?

  4. Re 15D wordplay: Empty = EVACUATE, first couple quit = ACUATE, storing money =

    Wasn’t too keen on “surgery” as an anagram indicator in 22/23D – I prefer them to be verbs.

    Don’t know what universe you inhabit, Peter, but I have never heard of anything remotely like what you describe for 13A, as opposed to what I would think is the far more well-known popular culture reference :)

  5. I suppose the ‘pop culture reference’ is Star Wars, jnrj, but interestingly, the defence argument meaning is also from pop culture too. It comes from an episode of South Park, at least according to one Google hit I had.
    I enjoyed this DA, but can’t quite work out the wordplay of 24D. An hints on that?
    SM )

  6. Thanks jnrj. It all becomes clear.

    24D The Tweed River is in northern NSW, when truncated becomes twee

  7. While we’re on the subject of pop culture references, the idea of introducing something completely irrelevant also has a link to 2/8D, since it was Hitchcock who made use of the so-called “Macguffin” as an irrelevant plot feature.

  8. Is it the case in 10a that hotel refers to the letter H and in 3D black is the letter B? I accept C and H for hot & cold but these two are a step beyond. Also, stove is one of DA’s more obscure anagram indicators (27a).

  9. Ripped through all but four answers over breaky; then, after dinner, knocked off three more. That left 7D, which I looked at for ages thinking ETNA (based on the last four letters: _T_A). One quick glance from the person I hold hands with was all she needed to snap KRAKATOA.

    The only ones I don’t quite get are 22A and 25A.

    If 22A MODERN ART, and since you win the Turner Prize for modern art, is it even a cryptic clue? Is the “Maybe” just there for garnish?

    And how do the ellipses link 22A and 25A? Seems to me 25A works fine by itself.

  10. I’m unsure of 22A also, the only thing i can think of is if it’s unlit, as opposed to & lit, there is no cryptic component

  11. I think, JK, that H is used on street maps to indicate the whereabouts of a hotel, but I’m not too sure, either, of B for black. I can think of B&W (sometimes B/W) as an abbreviation when describing illustrations, but in chess B=bishop and with pencils B=soft, both, I would have thought, preferable for use in clues.

    I can’t find the cryptic bit of 22A, either.

    Otherwise, all I’m stuck on is 9A.

  12. No sooner had I posted my comment than 9A came to me. Golf is, for personal reasons, the last thing I think of.

  13. 22a: “art” is a Shakespearian English word, second person singular of the verb “to be”. Thus “maybe are”.

  14. H for hotel is part of the radio alphabet. Fine if not overused. B for black is commonplace in the chess column of the paper.

  15. 22A art is the archaic form of are, hence are is modern art.

    B=black and H=hotel are perfectly are acceptable abbreviations – both are often used in cryptic crosswords.

  16. Thanks for 22A explanation Ian and HS. That’s a nice clue. Regarding the link between 22A and 25A raised by TT, I thought maybe the surface reading of 25A was describing a Turner Prize entry, or entrant? Perhaps a reference to the Turner Prize age limit of 50? (according to Wikipedia?). and “dark and flat”, the artwork? or the artist? of course the clue stands on its own as a simple clue itself.

  17. Thanks Ian, HS, for enlightenment on 22A (are/art).

    Re dodgy anagram indicators, I thought “stove” in 27D was obscure but OK; but I shared jnrj’s dislike of “surgery” in 22/23D.

    Also, I didn’t like “shirt” in 26A to indicate the first letter. Surely a shirt covers both front and back so it could be used to signify first and last letter but not just the first. Has anyone got a better explanation?

    I did like 2/8D (Hitchcock feature).

  18. RB, shirt = T (t-shirt)

    re the ellipsis, i thought that as is usually the case, that it serves only surface reading

  19. Thanks mic – of course! We’ve had that before but I just didn’t see it this time.

  20. Thanks Ian, HR – I suppose that makes the entire radio alphabet fair game in future.

    Stove is the past participle of stave, one of the meanings of which is to break up – a little obscure as I said (like art in its archaic meaning) but certainly acceptable and nicely misleading when first read.

    Surgery (which is what I do) is cutting things up, usually to put them together again in an improved arrangement, and therefore also, I think, acceptable (although often we cut, remove a part, and then repair – which could be problematic).

  21. My dislike of “surgery” as an anagram indicator stems not from its meaning but from the fact that it’s a NOUN placed BEFORE the fodder. I think it would have been acceptable if placed AFTER the fodder (as in “bowel surgery”) indicating an action to be taken on the fodder. Of course, it would have completely wrecked the beautiful surface reading!

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