The Confusion on 8/9th of October, 2010

Perplexed? Have your questions resolved below.

Update: A few perplexities remain:

2 down: HHER 4-down (Presley) 27-across (hit)?
So what’s the Presley song?

4 down: The King makes rubberneck admit other revolt (7)
Has DA committed the cardinal sin: an indirect anagram? Here’s how I see this one: rubberneck admit other revolt = PRY admit ELSE revolt = PRY admit ESLE = PRESLEY = The King.

Is there a more elegant solution that doesn’t have DA looking like a flagrant indirect anagrammatiser?

35 thoughts on “The Confusion on 8/9th of October, 2010

  1. Great crossword – am a fan of 4 down so enjoyed the theme. Have got it all except 10 across. I think I have the answer but am struggling with the wordplay. Can anyone help?

  2. It’s a double definition. name of a drink …. and the name for a rest thjt might be found in a pool hall. (I don’t like double defns….. no cryptic work)

  3. Thanks Steve – obviously I haven’t spent enough time in pool halls. It turns out my youth was not as misspent as I thought it was…

  4. Yes I was stuck on 10 – got the answer but didn’t know why until I gave my husband the whole clue and he got it straight away. I was going too deep – Steve’s comment applies.
    First time I’ve ever got the whole DA out! .. but with help of Google on the 4 down 27 across clues. Don’t really get the 1 down meaning though. Any suggestions?

  5. Likewise a long-time 4D fan, so it was fairly straightforward. Stuck on what should surely be easy, though: 17A (even with the three intersecting letters).
    For some strange reason had to wait for the Sunday Age to get the A2 section this weekend (got one of the Sunday sections on Sat, dated the 10th).

  6. Gayle, 1d is an anagram of “ism discussion up” (disguised anagrind “surreal”). Presumably, 6d uses 15a as the anagrind? We are still struggling with the wordplay for 16a – the “irresponsible boozing” part.

    PS I enjoyed this crossword, perhaps because it took us a little longer than most of you to get 4d. Once we had this most of the references to 4d, 27a were easy guesswork, following which we figured out the wordplay (not the ideal way to solve a crossword).

  7. JK, the three letter solution for ‘irresponsible boozing’ is what is now called PCA and used to be called …

  8. No closer to 14d despite all the cross words. And 22a too, though I feel that’s probably am easy one

  9. VR, you might never have heard of 14D. It’s to do with Aussies and where they hang out in London.

    And 22A involves an anagram in a synonym.

  10. While I have the (obscure) answer to 2D, I’m not sure I understand how the “HHER” works.

  11. Actually, I think it’s been many years since 14D was where Aussies gathered. Perhaps DA is somewhat out of date. And I still can’t figure out 17A

  12. Dave R – Come on, you’re not trying, on 17A! If you’ve worked out the rest of the crossword you’ve solved many much more difficult clues.

  13. AS, DA doesn’t do indirect anagrams. ESLE is ELSE reversed. I assume that revolt is used in the sense of an “uprising”.

  14. 13a, 20a: git= shoo, as in “G’wan, git!” said to a pesky varmint. So the whole thing is a homonym of “swayed shoes.”

  15. ummm… hello, i’m new. i found out about this site at the DA talk at the wheeler last week. i did get the crossword out but was wondering if someone could help with an explanation (don’t have the grid in front of me so not sure of the number) for the last word of the right-most downward clue??

  16. You were right, IG, and thanks. Thanks, too, to AS. Two double definitions in the one puzzle is a bit unlike DA, but that’s only a comment, not an excuse.

  17. That would be “tonight”?

    This one was a personal best for us. When SGB got “Presley” I got “Are You Lonesome Tonight” just by looking at the grid. Considering that I bought the 45 of “Heartbreak Hotel” in 1957, it was no surprise that the rest fell into place pretty quickly. Good fun.

  18. Star, the last word of 17 down is what’s left of the whole anagram , ‘drunk running in’. The two letter word for running is inserted in the word for drunk. But I see that’s the answer’s just been given by SGB and SPB above.

  19. Correction 7 down. I’m new to this site too. Husband (who doesn’t do cryptics) bought me Puzzled after I showed him a DA article which resonated for him. .. abandoning one’s life and family for the crossword. Don’t know why he’s encouraging me to spend even more hours tangling with DA .. will have to ponder that one now! ( I used to think DA was a mean old man in an attic somewhere until I heard an interview on the ABC.)

  20. Dave R – I agree DA doesn’t usually do many double defs, but here I counted four: 10A, 15A, 17A, 27A. Did anyone else think “gits on air” = SHOES a bit too far-fetched/unfair? I can just about accept git=shoo, but when pluralised and homophoned, it’s too much for me.

  21. RB – Follow-up on HHER: thanks for your explanation, but it seems almost too lame to be credible. Why is it capitalised? Why not (if that’s the explanation) H-her ? And for that matter, why the question mark at the end of the clue?

    Also: I agree that “gits = shoos” is a stretch. “Git!” is used as “Shoo!”, but you wouldn’t say that “She gits the pests away”.

  22. hmmm…I thought HHER was for Her Highness Eliz Regina, being an example of a hard headed woman?

  23. Nice work with the Brazilian reference there, philth. Elis Regina is a mad musical goddess, but I reckon that would be too obscure a reference for an English-language cryptic.

  24. Well, so far, I think my explanation is better than the Eliz or Elis explanation, but I agree with IG: it’s very lame. As for why capitals and why question mark, I’ve no idea. DA often uses the latter to highlight a “dodgy” clue. Maybe DA’s a bit pushed for time now that he’s a TV star.

  25. I initially thought the HH was for a 2H pencil ie hard-headed and ER for Elizabeth Regina, meaning woman, which could account for the capitals, the question mark being that one can’t be sure that’s how she would be described.
    Considering the possibilities of HH Her Highness and ER, I thought the question mark was acknowledging that her title is not HH but HM.
    Or maybe the question mark was DA’s own sense of fun with the various possibilities, including H + HER, which may be bit too easy.

  26. this is my third attempt at commenting to thank everyone for their “tonight” explanations… are comments moderated? in any case, just wanted to say thanks for your help. until next week =)

  27. Comments are not moderated unless the software thinks a comment is spam.

    But your earlier two attempts at commenting didn’t register at all with the software. Don’t know why that happened, although the cheap hosting arrangement I have for this website could have something to do with it.

  28. re 4 down – I wondered about indirect anagrams too, but ESLE here is not an anagram of ELSE, it is its reversal, as shown (if obscurely) by the word “revolt”.

  29. 2 down – again very obscure, but if Presley is the King and he’s looking for a woman, then she would have to be a Queen (OK, that’s about 4 layers of abstraction now). Hence ER, and HH is a type of pencil.

    DA would not use ER to mean just any old woman, and he would say “ER, for example” if ER is but one instance of the genre. H-HER is a less good line of interpretation, because it grammatically it should not be in accusative case and should thus be H-She.

    I am forced to interpret it this way becuse ER is not particularly known for being “hard headed”, although hers is no job for a wuss. But I can’t imagine her bossing Phil the Greek around.

  30. Not sure which side of the fence you’re on, SR, regarding 2D, but I have to go with H (hard-headed) HER (woman), rather than HH (pencil) ER (the Queen). The latter explanation is just too far-fetched. Why bring pencils into it? HH pencils have a hard LEAD not a hard HEAD. Also, as SR says, the Queen is not just any old woman, and there’s no “for example” to support this interpretation.

    So I go for the first (admittedly lame) explanation. I don’t think SB’s nominative/accusative argument is very strong, as “woman” can be either case.

    Whichever is correct, I nominate this clue as a real stinker. AS – is it bad enough for DA Bullshit?

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